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Mics and lights

  • 1.  Mics and lights

    Posted 10-04-2022 22:30
    Hi all.  I'm trying to bring my high school theatre up to date and need help finding headset mics with receivers.  We have 5 line 6 mics and receivers but need 5 more.  Also, I'm running a lighting system console from the 90's.  Does anyone know where to find a new up to date system that can run about 60 lights?  I'd love to find new lights as well, but need to start slow.  Thanks for you help.

    ------------------------------
    Ernesto Rosas - SAG-AFTRA
    Theatre Arts Teacher
    East Hickman High School
    Lyles, TN
    ------------------------------


  • 2.  RE: Mics and lights

    Posted 10-05-2022 07:02
    For Mics, I recommend reaching out to Bodymics, Rod the owner is a supporter of the EDTA, he regularly exhibits at the conferences.

    For the console there are some other questions to look into for determining the correct console for you.

    1) The 60 lights ... are they Quartz on dimmers? or LED? Additional channels are needed for color changing LED.
    2) How many dimmers do you have total, or relays controlled by the console?
    3) What are the colleges and Universities using in your area, you would want to use a similar format to what they have (brand) so your students don't move on to college at a disadvantage, usually there are different levels of console in a brand so you don't necessarily need to by the exact console.
    4) Make sure when you get a quote for the console training is included, typically 4 hours minimum and make sure your interested students and anyone running the console can be there at the training time.

    You will most likely be learning a new programming scheme, so go into this with an open mind, a lot has changed over the past 20 years.

    Good Luck in your searches

    ------------------------------
    Jerry Onik
    V.P. Theatrical Supplies and Equipment
    Heartland Scenic Studio
    NE
    ------------------------------



  • 3.  RE: Mics and lights

    Posted 10-05-2022 09:23
    Thanks for the tip.  I'll definitely check them out.  As for the console I'm running a Strand 300 series.  I just started at the school and have only begun to learn the system ( I know how to turn it on, bypass the previously saved setup, and manually fade, then turn it off!!!)  The lights look like a mix of different par cans.  None of which move automatically.   The district doesn't have a lot of money and the theatre department has the least of all other departments.  My goal is to bring it up to the modern age as much as possible throughout the next few years.  I need a cyc, new curtains, new lights and new monitors.  This place is roached.  Holes and tears in the curtains, a student stole some speakers a while back and they were never replaced, and the light board and computer are dinosaurs.  I'll have to check on the specs for the lights.

    ------------------------------
    Ernesto Rosas - SAG-AFTRA
    Theatre Arts Teacher
    East Hickman High School
    Lyles, TN
    ------------------------------



  • 4.  RE: Mics and lights

    Posted 10-05-2022 07:09
    Hi, I how large and what type of theatre are you trying to outfit?
    You should also see how much power your space is capable of sustaining.
    Keep this thread going, I am also trying to up our in house mics. 

    I would recommend calling in a professional company to help sort out your needs. You can always say no if the bid is too high. 


    ------------------------------
    Jo Pillsbury
    Theatre Director Rochester Adams High School
    Summer Music Theatre Director, Rochester Community Schools
    Rochester, Michigan
    ------------------------------



  • 5.  RE: Mics and lights

    Posted 10-05-2022 09:46
    It's a pretty big auditorium.  Has three rows of lights,  goes up past 60, but not all work and not all are plugged into the correct outlet.  I'm still trying to figure out the schematics of the place.  No one at the school knows.  And the last theatre teacher didn't really do much for 7 years, she just made them do crafts and improv skits for productions.  The last time this theatre program was pumping was in 2005, I believe.  When that teacher retired, I was told the whole program began to die.  From the looks of it, it looks like it was slow death.  SO, I'm trying to breathe some life back into it.  However, budget is real thin s I have to take baby steps.  Right now, I just need to figure out what a new console would cost, and if it could power what we have now and will switch to later.  I'm thinking LEDs that can change color, switch to gobos, etc.,  motorized would be awesome, but I KNOW we don't have the budget for that, yet.  As far as mics, everywhere I look, I only find the cheap no name bundles.  I've used Pyle-Pro but it was a really small space and they weren't that great.  Other than the knock offs I only see the mic sold separately, I need the pack and receiver.. 5 of them.  If you find something that could work for you, please pass on the info.  My seniors are doing Almost, Maine in December and I've only got 5 mic packs.

    Thanks for responding.

    ------------------------------
    Ernesto Rosas - SAG-AFTRA
    Theatre Arts Teacher
    East Hickman High School
    Lyles, TN
    ------------------------------



  • 6.  RE: Mics and lights

    Posted 10-05-2022 07:34
    Mr. Rosas - My go-to is SWEETWATER.  They are incredible at finding the best deal for what you need. 


    --

    Keith Rollins

    MCHS Drama Director

    Thespian Troupe #596

    706-695-1414


    This is a staff email account managed by Murray County School District.  This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the sender.





  • 7.  RE: Mics and lights

    Posted 10-05-2022 08:51
    Do you browse online or do you have a got to person?

    I have a go to guy there for my personal recording equipment, I have never used them for school stuff.  I'm new at having to order this kinda equipment, so when I look online, I just see the mics, not pack with receivers, etc.

    Thanks for the recommdendation.

    ------------------------------
    Ernesto Rosas - SAG-AFTRA
    Theatre Arts Teacher
    East Hickman High School
    Lyles, TN
    ------------------------------



  • 8.  RE: Mics and lights

    Posted 10-05-2022 08:59
    There are reps assigned to specific regions.  Here in GA, I have a guy named Vern I run everything through.  He (or your rep from Sweetwater) will give you better pricing for schools as well.  Call em up and see what they say.   We just had to raise money for a travelling sound system and mics for our One Act Competition. They've been a great help. 

    Good luck!

    --

    Keith Rollins

    MCHS Drama Director

    Thespian Troupe #596

    706-695-1414


    This is a staff email account managed by Murray County School District.  This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the sender.





  • 9.  RE: Mics and lights

    Posted 10-05-2022 09:51
    Ernesto,

    Just purchased from Rod at Bodymics, was a pleasure working with him and he sort of walked me through the process to get the best deal. Definitely reach out to him, we are looking forward to using our 16 new bodypacs in November for The Little Mermaid! I believe it is Rod Riely if you want to look him up on here.

    ------------------------------
    Bruce Udell
    St. Mary Cathedral School
    MI
    ------------------------------



  • 10.  RE: Mics and lights

    Posted 10-06-2022 08:41
    Ernesto

    Thanks for reaching out . Thanks to Jerry and Bruce for the shout out.

    I replied to you email yesterday, but thought I would put out some thoughts for the group similar to those I sent to you.

    Please avoid off brands - especially no name ones from companies that are not really involved in theatre audio.  Our Creative Audio range is of course the exception ....  only because our design premise was how can we build a cost effective theatre wireless system based on our 45 years of doing theatre audio.

    If you are in or near crowded metro areas we highly recommend the use of digital audio over UHF systems (currently only made by Sennheiser and Shure) as these allow us to get good numbers of systems playing nicely together in the limited band-width we now have to operate in.  Avoid anything transmitting on 2.4gHz or 5.8gHz bands as these can prove problematic around WiFi hotspots, and are limited to 10-11 sets working together.  That may sound a lot when starting out, but just based on our clients rental requests we know that 8 this year will likely become 12 next year and then 16 and 5 years our you are trying to work out how to mic your show with just 20 channels.  Give yourself room to grow.

    Having said all that, good or better mics are not the whole answer.  It seems that the current perception of a sound system is that any speaker set is just fine and it doesn't really matter how it is placed!!!! I have lost track of the number of schools that tell me they have a great sound system, only to find out they are using a major brand name box with a 15" woofer and horn speaker mounted either side of the stage  up 12 or so ft and mounted flush to the floor.  If you have a physic teacher handy ask them about how sound travels from a box like this placed up there. 

    85-90% of the sound in this situation is being pumped into the air above the audience's heads, and much of it is bouncing off the side and rear walls creative all sorts of reverb and echos - all this lowers the volume before feedback.  Moral - less is often better.  Speakers should be vocal oriented (multiple small speakers cones - 2-4" is my sweet spot); have a relatively narrow vertical dispersion pattern (20-40 degrees is the range - achieved by mounting these small cone speaker in a column to provide a more controlled dispersion pattern) - less wasted energy; then mounted high - 12-16ft above floor, angled inwards and pointed at head height 2/3rds of the way into the seating area. These is a very generic description and each room and use requires a little more engineering to get it right.  We refer to the standard 2 way speaker boxes as DISCO BOXES because their main aim is to pump out heaps of bass with little or no regard to the voice.

    The other issue with most of these "disco boxes" is that the horn speaker cuts in right in the middle of the vocal range, causing a distinct difference in voice quality for notes above and below this cut over.  We have been using column type speakers for theatre since our start back in 1977, and in just the last decade have the major brands started to follow our lead with some of their designs (Bose L1, JBL Eon One, EV, LD Systems, RCF and others with their compact sub and mounted column designs boxes.)  Yes you will need to consider using a subwoofer or two to enhance the bass - cross these over to handle signals below 200Hz (150-250Hz range usually works great.)

    My point is .... if you want good sound, the most critical components in order of importance are
    • speaker system - design, quality and placement
    • microphone elements - good mid market is as good as you need (as it is unlikely that the rest of the system will benefit from top end units) - BRANDS - bodymics, Microphone Madness, Point Source, entry level Shure
    • mixer - if over 12 wireless seriously consider a digital console with 100 scene memories - Soundcraft, Allen & Heath, Behringer
    • wireless systems - stick with major brands for reliability and sound - Creative Audio, Shure, Sennheiser, MiPro and if you must Audio-Technica (why must?  AT uses a proprietary mic connector that limits your choice of microphone severely - mainly to their own mics and some high end brands)
    If you have limited capital then this is the order to work on things - since microphone systems are the easiest to (lowest cost) rent then we think that they should be rented until the rest of the system is in great condition to make the most of your shows. (yeah I'm biased as I rent wireless mics but it's still true)

    The other thing about renting wireless is the best use of capital.  If you only do 1 or 2 shows per year, the economics of renting makes it a no brainer, somewhere between 3 and 4 makes it viable to at least own a core of 8-12 channels. 

    The advantages of renting wireless systems include
    • getting the number of systems you need vs. fitting the show around what you have
    • no maintenance - other than cost of repairing actually damaged equipment
    • no storage
    • no worrying what other departments might do - loss of transmitters, broken mics
    • no worries abut theft or vandalism between shows
    • better use of capital

    If you or anyone has questions please feel free to reach out

    ------------------------------
    Rod Reilly
    Owner, Bodymics
    908-899-1277
    NJ and NY offices
    rod@bodymics.com
    ------------------------------



  • 11.  RE: Mics and lights

    Posted 10-06-2022 09:03
    For controlling the lights, the best cheap option is probably a Nomad system from ETC, which runs on a PC. It's $250 for educational use. It runs the same software as their boards.

    ------------------------------
    Ken Buswell
    Drama Teacher
    Peachtree City, GA
    http://mcintoshtheater.org/

    Theater kills ignorance
    ------------------------------



  • 12.  RE: Mics and lights

    Posted 10-07-2022 05:41
    To respond to Ken Buswell's comment.

    ETC is not currently doing the $250 Package, they are having issues making the Gadget II units, they are currently selling the dongle for a cost of $ 200.00, then an aftermarket USB to DMX interface can be added at an additional charge

    ------------------------------
    Jerry Onik
    V.P. Theatrical Supplies and Equipment
    Heartland Scenic Studio
    NE
    ------------------------------