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How do you handle students rejecting smaller roles?

  • 1.  How do you handle students rejecting smaller roles?

    Posted 02-07-2018 11:52

    In the past, students have indicated on their audition sheet whether they would accept a small/ensemble role. There have been a few occasions when I have not cast someone because of their choice not to take a small role, and I have had a few students drop out or not accept a smaller role after the cast list is posted.

    I am very tempted to change my policy and tell students not to audition if they're not willing to take an ensemble role – and if they are cast and drop out they won't be allowed to audition for a year.

    I realize many students are juggling different activities and may decide that a small role is not as fulfilling as some of their other activities they could do, but part of me want to get tougher and tell the kids that if they are actors, then they act, regardless of the size of the role.

    How do you deal with this? Do you have a set policy or deal with things case-by-case?



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    Ken Buswell
    Drama Teacher
    Peachtree City, GA
    http://mcintoshtheater.org/

    Theater kills ignorance
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  • 2.  RE: How do you handle students rejecting smaller roles?

    Posted 02-07-2018 13:05
    I don't post a cast list. Instead we call and offer each part in the show. This allows the kids to refuse the part before the cast listed is released and has really reduced the number of drops. I almost never have a issue with this anymore.

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    Shira Schwartz
    Chandler Unified School District
    Chandler AZ
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    Original Message


  • 3.  RE: How do you handle students rejecting smaller roles?

    Posted 02-07-2018 15:15
    I told my kids this year that if they indicate they will take any role they are cast on the audition form and then drop out if it is a chorus role, it will severely impact their getting cast in a lead role while in high school. I would rather they be honest and say on the form that they will not take a chorus role, than they lie and then drop out. Only had one student not accept the role and it was due to an unexpected family event.

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    Zach Schneider Troupe No. 1
    Natrona County High School
    Wyoming Chapter Director
    Casper WY
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    Original Message


  • 4.  RE: How do you handle students rejecting smaller roles?

    Posted 02-08-2018 06:55
    Like Shira, we used to call every student individually and offer them their part (instead of posting a cast list), which worked out really well for us. Nowadays, we don't even offer specific roles upfront to students. Everyone accepts a space in the ensemble and then, after they've been working together for a few days, we decide who will receive which role.


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    Victoria Chatfield
    Executive Director
    National Theatre for Student Artists
    www.nationalstudenttheatre.org
    vchatfield@nationalstudenttheatre.org
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    Original Message


  • 5.  RE: How do you handle students rejecting smaller roles?

    Posted 02-08-2018 07:40
    ​I teach at a very large high school.  We have to cut between 50 and 70 people each year.  Our students are very glad to get those small roles!
    However, when someone does "diva out" on us and quit, usually we let them know that quitting will affect future casting decisions and it has.  Also, their quitting opens up a spot for someone else to get a part, so that ends up being a positive.  I guess I'm not much help!

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    Amber Hugus
    Harmony PA
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    Original Message


  • 6.  RE: How do you handle students rejecting smaller roles?

    Posted 02-08-2018 09:44
    We do three shows: 2 musicals and a play. Only 1 of the musicals is a “cut” show. The other two, everyone who auditions gets cast.

    My policy is this: If you audition and you drop before callbacks are posted (you realize you’re in over your head, you think your audition went terribly and are embarrassed, another conflict came up), there is no penalty. If you drop after callbacks are posted but before the show is cast, you are prohibited from participating in the next musical. If you drop AFTER the cast list has been posted, you are prohibited from participating for the next full set of shows (2 musicals, 1 play and the student showcase).

    There is still behind my back whining about smaller roles. I’ve had parents contact me because their child if in hysterical tears because she has had a lead in every show since her freshman year and now her “talent is being wasted” in the dance ensemble (and how dare I give a sophomore the part that she wanted).

    But I, in just 4 shows, have developed a reputation of really building up the tiny roles to make them meatier and memorable. So my ensemble kids usually end up getting over themselves and sticking with it.


    Original Message


  • 7.  RE: How do you handle students rejecting smaller roles?

    Posted 02-09-2018 12:17
    If a kid puts larger role only, I question it at the auditions. Most times they are embarrassed enough to say they were confused as to what that meant.
    As an actor, I understand getting to a point where I don't want to commit the time for an ensemble role.
    As a director, I remember who dropped so I am cautious about their commitment level the next time. It turns out that the following year, most don't move up too far because it is obvious at auditions that they didn't grow like those who were in the year before.

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  • 8.  RE: How do you handle students rejecting smaller roles?

    Posted 02-08-2018 12:43
    Our department makes it a rule that if you list you will accept any role and then you drop out, you are ineligible to be in any play or musical for one calendar year and/or will not be eligible for any awards or scholarships.  They sign a contract stating this: Students auditioning for a specific role, indicated exclusively and clearly on their audition sheet, that are not get cast in that role, will be allowed to drop out of a production without penalty if they drop immediately after the list is posted. Students auditioning for any role(s) that withdraw and/or are removed from a production once a role has been assigned, cause considerable hardship for their fellow actors, technical crew and directors. Therefore, failure to comply with this contract will result in your exclusion from future HS productions including, but not limited to the Fall Play, Variety Pops, the Thespian Play and future musicals for one calendar year from the last performance date of this production (April 29, 2018). This means that the next show you could audition for will be the Fall Play in November, 2019. In addition, students withdrawing from this production may also become ineligible for any Performing Arts honors, awards and/or scholarships. 

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    Kathleen Horrigan
    Theatre Arts Director
    Lawrence Central High School
    Indianapolis IN
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    Original Message


  • 9.  RE: How do you handle students rejecting smaller roles?

    Posted 02-08-2018 14:03
    Wow. I am just amazed at what you teachers have to go through. Even with an occasional cantankerous director, I think being a set designer is a walk in the park.  :-)

    In any case, the first thing that went through my mind was to say, hey, kid, not everybody can be the quarterback or the pitcher. Every position out there is important. So take it or leave it.

    Actually, I wonder how sports coaches handle the same issue?

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    George F. Ledo
    Set designer
    www.setdesignandtech.wordpress.com
    www.georgefledo.net
    http://astore.amazon.com/sdtbookstore-20
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    Original Message


  • 10.  RE: How do you handle students rejecting smaller roles?

    Posted 02-08-2018 14:40

    As a freelance director in the Cincinnati area, I can tell you that this same problem arises in the professional world. I am currently directing a production of A Streetcar Named Desire, which we held auditions for back in October. I had two actors who I offered supporting roles to over the phone who then proceeded to decline them despite the fact that they put on their forms that they would be willing to accept any role other than the ones that they were initially gunning for. Both my artistic director and myself found ourselves agitated by this situation and definitely made note about these actors reliability and honesty, or lack their of, when it came to casting them for for future shows.

    You can let you students know that if they circle the box saying "No" to "Are you willing to acceptable other roles than the ones you would like to be considered for" that there isn't any shame in it. But for those who do circle "Yes" and then decline simply because they feel a part is to small or won't be any fun, let them know that they are only as good as their word and their work ethic. If you can't be trusted by what you put on your form, then why should you be trusted in a rehearsal room?

    And I had actors who did put "No" they don't want to be considered for other roles. Do I think less of them? Absolutely not. They were honest and it made my job casting the show much easier.

    Not having cast a show at a high school level since I was in high school, I can only be sympathetic to the specifics rather than empathetic. What you can tell your students before they audition is that even a small role or a chorus role poses its own challenges and rewards. It makes you consider "how do I make something that seems like a small role important to me?" And you can point to countless Broadway stars and famous actors who have started as "one line parts" or "chorus understudies." As an actor, work is work. As long as you are treated humanely and you are in a safe work environment, your job is to commit to your objective whole-heartily, whether it is Stanley Kowalski in a professional production or a line in a local commercial. Because people respect your work ethic as much as they respect your natural talent, if not more so. 



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    Nate Netzley
    Cincinnati OH
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    Original Message


  • 11.  RE: How do you handle students rejecting smaller roles?

    Posted 02-09-2018 09:13
    As a high school student, I rejected a small role after having multiple leads. My teachers didn't handle it well and were pretty awful to me. I was a kid with hurt feelings and a bruised ego and would have benefitted from some understanding and a realistic conversation about the arts. So when I had a student this year reject an ensemble role only to return the following day to ask for it back. As an educator, I felt that there was more to be learned by letting him participate than by telling him no. He's been a spectacular ensemble member. My bottom line is, this is a teachable moment and a moment for us to demonstrate fairness as well as kindness. I think as long as any decision you make is framed by both of those things, you are ok.

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    Bernadette MacLeod
    Charlotte NC
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    Original Message


  • 12.  RE: How do you handle students rejecting smaller roles?

    Posted 02-09-2018 09:24
    Well, I teach at a large school and competition is pretty fierce.  Our policy is if someone wants to bail before a cast list is posted, no harm - no foul!  If it is after a cast list is posted and then they bail I don't even let them read for me for one calendar year.  I expressly said this one time and it scared them all enough that it really hasn't been a problem. If there are complaints, they know better to bring them to me.  Whining is a pet peeve of mine.

    If I have a kid read for a lead and then realize that the only thing I can offer that kid is a smaller role, I will usually  initiate a conversation about that option to him/her before they leave the audition so that they can ruminate on that possibility and it gives them an opportunity to tell me that they'd rather not be in the show. Usually, this is only if they are a super dedicated kid who have been in significant roles for me in the past.  It's only happened one time and that kid asked if, instead they could ASM.  It was before the cast list was posted so I was fine.  

    As far as parents, man, it's only happened once but it was super uncomfortable.  I just repeat my mantra, "Not everyone is going to see or agree with my vision for this particular show.  I hope Joe/Jill can see that this is not personal and that he/she is a valuable part of this program."  And then do not engage!

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    Christine DeFrancesco
    Theatre Teacher
    Huntley High School
    Huntley, IL
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    Original Message


  • 13.  RE: How do you handle students rejecting smaller roles?

    Posted 02-12-2018 10:36
    My answer is a little oblique. I only had this issue very rarely.

    1. I allowed students to request to be read for certain roles, but warned them that if they put of the form that they would only accept one particular part, they would not be cast at all.
    2. I had a policy of rotating my leads. If you had a lead role in the previous show, you were not eligible for one in the current show.
    3. I had an ongoing mantras of "Brilliant leads can't save a bad show, but poor ensemble members can kill a good one." and "Small roles have so much more opportunity for personalized character development than large ones."
    4. I warned any student considering dropping a role that I "had a long memory" and that this particular choice would affect their future casting opportunities.
    5. I sometimes had performers request only a smaller role when they were working on other activities. I was happy to accommodate that request.

    Funny side story. I was auditioning Seven Brides for Seven Brothers and one of my ultra reliable students put on his audition sheet, in the role box, "anything but Adam would be nice." The choral director and I were a little surprised that he didn't want the lead, but assumed that he was really busy, as he normally was, wanted to be in the show, but didn't want to have the additional responsibility of a lead. After the cast list was posted, he approached me and asked why I hadn't read him for Adam. I reminded him of his request on the audition sheet. He looked puzzled for a moment and then said, no, "Anything, but Adam would be nice." He was pleased with his casting and this only resulted in a good laugh among the three of us, but I often reminded students afterward of the importance of commas.

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    Robert Smith
    VA Co-Chapter Director
    Retired
    Centreville VA
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    Original Message


  • 14.  RE: How do you handle students rejecting smaller roles?

    Posted 02-12-2018 17:29

    FWIW: My son was a child actor at ages 8,9,10, then left the field when his voice started to change and he just wasn't so cute anymore! When he got into HS in 9th grade, a somewhat seasoned professional actor (AEA), he auditioned for the school production of Fiddler and got an ensemble role. Never uttered a peep, he was fine with that, and with his older brother getting Tevye. No small roles...only...well, you know the rest. A friend of mine was in 3 Tony-award winning shows, then spent 20 years on the West End. Came back to NY and started out in regional theatre, several times, now is a swing on Broadway. These kinds of things happen all the time, and may be  good anecdotes to discuss with students, maybe have a folder of headshots/resumes of successful (i.e. working!) actors to show them early on in the process? 

    Amy Goldin



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    Amy Goldin
    COPA Inc.: College Options in the Performing Arts
    www.performingartsoptions.com
    516-674-6116
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    Original Message


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