Open Forum

 View Only

  • 1.  Unruly elements

    Posted 04-23-2015 09:05

    Its that time of year when the wheels start falling off, and everybody gets tired, and I'm slowly losing the plot.

    I think this is a classroom management/discipline issue. Please be gentle.

    I have about 5 students in each of my theatre classes who should not be there. I have tried everything I can think of to incorporate them, including giving of responsibility, separating them, catching them being good, marking them down in participation/attitude scores, encouragement, berating, carrot and stick, reasoning, blah yadda rah.

    Near the end of the year, they are about as willing to be constructively participatory as a pile of lemmings, except they won't jump off the cliff.

    Has anyone had experience of this? What do you do? I'm tempted to create a packet of materials that they will have to sit in separate corners of the auditorium to complete, in silence, whilst the rest of the class works on more participatory, active, and community stuff. I am reluctant to, as it feels to me that I am 'giving up' on the idea of theatre as an essential, transformative experience.

    Am I being too optimistic? Are they just some cases you can't win?

    ------------------------------
    Phillip Goodchild
    Ruskin FL
    ------------------------------



  • 2.  RE: Unruly elements

    Posted 04-23-2015 13:22

    I have appreciated comments you've made in other discussions, so it is obvious you have tried about all you know how to do.

    Connecting to their interests is about all I think you haven't listed.  I have had rotten apples...many...over the years.  One year it was a school of them.  I found at that time making movie trailers was the way to go.  We had a standardized test that they all hated.  They worked into groups to make movies on how to and how not to prepare for the test.  The movies were shown for a number of years and those kids became legends. 

     Teaming up with younger grades works well, too.  When a turkey gets to be a mentor, sometimes they step it up and actually do some very nice things.

    Sometimes I have let them fail in the corner....

    I have had them removed from the room if I could document enough discipline issues. 

    I don't have a fail safe plan for all kids.  I find about this time we all just want to go away.  :)

    OHHHH!!!!  I almost missed the one that works the best!  IMPROV!  I teach a unit of improv at the beginning of the corner and those rascals are oftentimes brilliant and will do anything to get the attention they desire.  I also get to laugh a lot.  We bond.  It makes a big difference.

    ------------------------------
    Carol Knarr Gebert
    Celina OH
    ------------------------------


    Original Message


  • 3.  RE: Unruly elements

    Posted 04-23-2015 13:53
    Uugghhh. It's always so hard when this happens. Have you tried going back to some more physically interactive exercises? And which classes are you having trouble in? I have some "fun" assignments for my stagecraft class that has them working in groups... I also have an absolutely hellish test that I give to any students who skip school on "senior ditch day". ( I HATE this). I can send it to you if you want...

    ------------------------------
    Shira Schwartz
    Chandler Unified School District
    Chandler AZ
    ------------------------------


    Original Message


  • 4.  RE: Unruly elements

    Posted 04-24-2015 09:18

    Philip,

    I want to echo what someone has already said about you. I have admired the way you teach through your previous posts. You obviously have terrific instincts about your students and program.

    I have had similar situations but mostly with younger students, as my class has mixed grade levels in it. I had two students three years ago in a large class who really poisoned the dynamic in the group. I was continually questioning my own teaching and trying to "adjust" for them. In reflection, the students in question should have been removed from the class. They were clearly not willing to explore, commit, and engage at the level of the rest of my class, but the administration at the time felt they should be held accountable by forcing them to stay. 

    I know it may be too late in the year for this kind of action, but I would try to focus on your other students and spend less energy on those that are sucking oxygen from the room ;).

    Good Luck!

     

     

    ------------------------------
    Jen Jordan
    ------------------------------


    Original Message


  • 5.  RE: Unruly elements

    Posted 04-24-2015 10:17

    I tend to agree with Jen. Quite often difficult students thrive on simply being difficult. I have one student, with whom I actually have a very good relationship, who always finds a reason to not do what he's supposed to do. I could never plan with the intention of engaging him because he's going to find a reason, usually invalid, to disengage. And he's like this in every class with every teacher. Even in my class and P.E., where he's most engaged, he manages to object to something. I'm really the only teacher to whom he'll actually listen. I don't spend a lot of time or energy thinking about what will engage him. I plan for the rest of the class, and I allow him to choose whether or not he is going to be engaged, then I grade him accordingly. I don't allow him to become the focus of the classroom at any point in any way.

    I know we want to win every battle, but there are some we just can't because they're simply out of our control, and there are some we win by not fighting at all. The one thing you should not allow them to do is reap any reward for their lack of compliance. In other words, they should find no enjoyment out of the time they spend disengaged, and they should not receive any attention from peers when they are not on task. If they are willing to work on an alternate assignment that is still relevant to the class, and do so without any disruption, then I'm not against that. But be sure that in finding them "something else to do", you don't wind up doing a lot of work and they end up not doing any of it.
    ------------------------------
    Hugh Fletcher
    Performing Arts Coordinator
    IS 229 Dr. Roland Patterson Middle School
    Bronx NY
    ------------------------------


    Original Message


  • 6.  RE: Unruly elements

    Posted 04-24-2015 14:04

    Thank you everyone, for the advice and encouragement! I'm going to combine it all and work it through these last six weeks. Shira, my tech design/stagecraft class aren't the problem, most of the jokers don't pick that class, so it's actually a really nice collection of smart and curious future engineers, which is fun...! I'm learning to embrace my inner engineer.

    Agree with you, Hugh. Solid as always. :) My main concern was well articulated by you, it was what I was thinking when you phrased it as creating the separate assignments and creating a work task for me that wouldn't get done, that was the fear.

    Thanks again, everybody. Feeling all warm and fuzzy. :)

     


    ------------------------------
    Phillip Goodchild
    Ruskin FL
    ------------------------------


    Original Message


  • 7.  RE: Unruly elements

    Posted 04-25-2015 10:05
    I am retired and during the course of 44 years teaching, I have had several such groups. You've had excellent advice; I wanted to emphasize not to prepare separate work which creates another battle. I learner to pointed, almost rudely, to ignore them. I found it encouraging that years later one of the worst cases apologized saying she did not know why she did it and her behavior ruined her high school years! Take heart,it's not personal. ------------------------------ Jo Anne Elsken Ft Smith AR ------------------------------
    Original Message